Comments on: Are Pastors Paid To Love?

By: Patrick McLaughlin

Patrick McLaughlin — Mon, 04 Feb 2008 18:21:34 +0000

A non-Christian once again cites Jesus; “The workman is worthy of his wages.”

Only the wealthy and the almost-wealthy, supported by a successful working spouse have the option of working without pay. If they choose to do so, that’s fine–but I think that it would be a disastrous model for parish ministry, at least for us. On average, people perceive what they pay for very differently from what they’re just given. They value it differently. Hell, you can see it in attitudes where someone’s paid $1 to see a film, and a free film. There’s investment in something that you pay for.

I also think that the word “love” is too big a truck for what we expect a minister to do. I am certainly not intending to be my congregation’s lover. But the term “caritas” that often gets translated as love works just fine. I can care, and have deep affection and concern for… and do a bunch of work on behalf of that congregation that calls me.

I’ve seen the challenge to, and the demands on–and the lack of appreciation and respect given to clerg–who are just there as a gift of themselves. I’m sure there are times and places where it’s appropriate. I have no lack of regard for those who do such work. But it’s rarely appreciated or valued as it should be, and the work itself–what’s done–isn’t valued either.

By: Ann

Ann — Fri, 17 Aug 2007 03:57:02 +0000

I do think she was very clear that this was strictly HER experience. She clearly did have unrealistic expectations of herself, and that’s why she burned out, I believe. Brutal honesty (primarily with oneself, but also with others) about what one can and cannot do is essential in the ordained ministry, I believe. I am paid, in part, to CARE FOR people — different from loving. When people are dying or have died, are struggling, are fighting, etc. I am paid to care for, tend, and advise them as an ordained member of Christ’s body. Sometimes it’s the greatest grace and privilege of my life. Sometimes I’d rather be watching “Top Chef” with a glass of wine (oh, okay, I admit it — even Dr. Phil with an iced tea). But the thought of faithful parishioners dying without their pastor and priest at their side keeps me caring for them. But I don’t believe “love” can be paid for or commanded. Still, I do believe this is Taylor’s thought, and not meant to apply to others.

By: h sofia

h sofia — Tue, 17 Jul 2007 03:07:08 +0000

John - interesting! And thank you for the references to other folks - I’d like to learn more about these other models for ministry.

By: John Plummer

John Plummer — Mon, 16 Jul 2007 11:41:03 +0000

PB - I can really hear what Barbara Brwwn Taylor (and Madgebaby) are saying. The same has been said, with, ahem, a little more prophetic fire by folks from Roger Williams to Carlyle Marney. Now I’m sure that there are folks who can navigate the challenges of paid ministry in good ways. But, for the reasons cited by Taylor among others, I am happy to be part of a tradition (independent sacramental christianity) which is largely served by volunteer clergy. This requires “church” to be organized differently from the mainstream norm - smaller communities, a larger percentage of the membership ordained to some form of ministry (so there are enough hands on deck to get things done), creative forms of mentoring to train new clergy, different expectations regarding pastoral availability, etc, etc. Of course, this approach has its own problems. But it can be done well, and for myself, I really wouldn’t have it any other way.

By: Madgebaby

Madgebaby — Sun, 15 Jul 2007 22:10:36 +0000

I feel some ambivalence about this issue. On the one hand, we pay professionals to care for us all the time–therapists, physicians, nail techs, you name it–and the lines seem pretty clear. The thing with pastors is, on some level we really are paid friends to some people. We are expected to call them on their birthdays, to just “know” when they are sick or sad, and to make smart, pleasant banter at their parties. For other professions there are ethical guidelines that draw pretty clear boundaries around most of this. As a social worker I can ethically “fire” someone, particularly if they consistently ignore the boundaries of our relationship or disregard our agreements, but as a pastor? Much more difficult.

From my experience as a pastor of a congregation, I have my moments of agreement with BBT. As always she speaks the truth, but a hard truth. I love the sacramental parts of being clergy, I love the moments of real connection where God’s love is really made mainfest, but the other expectations that have nothing to do with all that were extreme and unexpected for me.

Part of the problem is that I don’t think people value the sacraments so much–having the Eucharist or being blessed while one is sick isn’t all that valued. Having someone to chat with is more valued.

For other people the sacraments are very commodified: I was asked to do a home baptism for people who did not attend church, by a friend of a friend, and offense was taken when I said that I’d be glad to if they came to the church but otherwise I could not (this wasn’t an emergency or a sick baby that couldn’t be around people–I’d make exceptions in plenty of cases.) I wasn’t being exclusive, but for me and for my tradition there has to be some sense of connection to the community. One can’t just get the baby “done”. Weddings are the same way. I was asked to do weddings on a couple weeks’ notice by people who were not involved with our church, because we have a beautiful building, and it was considered insulting that I thought some modicum of respect for the tradition (like six months notice, three premarital counseling sessions and a small fee for the use of the building) was too much to ask (although the flowers had been arranged and the dress bought nine months’ prior).

Currently I’m home caring for my little kids full time, and I’m glad for the time to punt and regroup. I have a feeling when I return to paid ministry, it will be in an environment where I have more control of my involvement, perhaps as a therapist or a chaplain. There is a sense of being owned in the parish that really can be draining.

By: Kaji

Kaji — Sun, 15 Jul 2007 02:07:58 +0000

I guess I would just add this: if you have to be paid, is loving the worse thing on the list? Many people are paid for many things, and I’m guessing that being paid to love (if that’s what ministry’s about, which I don’t think it is) would be better than anything else.

By: Diane

Diane — Sun, 15 Jul 2007 01:51:18 +0000

I guess that’s why BB Taylor is not a parish pastor any more. I don’t think it’s being paid to love. I do love the people, and the work (well, not 100% of the time), but I’m called to the mission of the church in a particular place, to help articlate a vision, to “equip the saints” for their ministry. I just don’t think that’s the same as being “paid to love.”

By: Ann

Ann — Sat, 14 Jul 2007 04:02:02 +0000

I always think of “pastor” as the one who takes care of people. I wish I were a better pastor. I’m a preacher and teacher, and even a fair administrator. I have a love for God, the Church, the liturgy, and the sacraments, and I think I communicate that love to others. And I do have a love for people, but that’s not paid for.

I love BBT. I have heard her speak and preach on numerous occasions, and have read a couple of her books (including Leaving Church) — but the collections of sermons don’t do much for me. But I do think she had a need to be indispensible and to be all things to all people.

As for unpaid ministry — Jesus just said last week that the worker (minister) deserves to be paid.

But can one really dispute how SHE felt? If SHE felt like a prostitute, then far be it from me to take that away from her.

By: God Guurrll

God Guurrll — Fri, 13 Jul 2007 12:06:41 +0000

As a pastor I am paid to preach the word of God and do the sacraments of baptism and eucharist. The administration, leading, meeting, pastoral care all fall under preaching/sacraments.

I consider the loving as a fringe benefit!

As far as whether one is qualified to do ministry. I believe that God does not call the qualified to do ministry, rather God qualifies the called.

By: BJ

BJ — Fri, 13 Jul 2007 02:39:22 +0000

From lay side of the altar rail…

You are called to vocation and I am thankful that you, and others are called and have responded (that ‘Here I am’ response has been nothing but trouble since…). I think that you would have to be crazy to be a Pastor/Priest as a job. I think that you are paid to teach, show, lead, cajole, and remind the rest of us that we are here to love one another as we have been loved - even, and especially when we are at our most unlovable worst. With that reminder comes the exhortation for all of us to take that outside into the workd and make or help reveal the Kingdon of God here on Earth. That is a gift. That is a calling. Thank you.

You are being paid for being the Adult Supervision. If you were a Kindergarten Teacher, you would be seeing that resources (paper, crayons, milk, graham crackers) are equitably distributed, that all work together, that no one wanders on out the door into the traffic, that those who need to go see the nurse or need to go to the potty get the attention that they need, that no one sticks the paper clips into the light socket, and that the students don’t run with or stab each other with the scissors. I imagine that my the clergy at my church can identify with the description of the Kindergarten Teacher most days.

Keep at it.